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RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

roteague — Tue, 29 Jan 2008 15:07:30 GMT

[quote][b]naturephoto1 (1/27/2008)[/b][hr]Yes Robert, and we know about the new computer programs that allow the digital photographer to simulate Kodachrome or Fujichrome Velvia 50 and even Ansel Adams.:blink::crying::(

Rich[/quote]

Just goes to show that some of these guys have no real clue.

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

naturephoto1 — Sun, 27 Jan 2008 20:22:58 GMT

[quote][b]roteague (1/27/2008)[/b][hr]
Software continually evolves, with the expressgoal of making it easier to use. For example, the latest version of Photoshop (CS3) and Lightroom both have a feature called "clarity". This is a new feature to both, howeverin previous versions you couldaccomplish the same thing using curves; manipulating curves is one of those techniques that many have found difficult to master. Clarity simplifies this by replacing that manipulation with a slider. And, that is just one example.[/quote]

Yes Robert, and we know about the new computer programs that allow the digital photographer to simulate Kodachrome or Fujichrome Velvia 50 and even Ansel Adams.:blink::crying::(

Rich

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

Jorge Gasteazoro — Sun, 27 Jan 2008 12:49:44 GMT

YoOu know better than I do in these cases, but IMO is not a matter of debunking because it then becomes an us vs them argument. My concern is the mindset required to create beautiful work and the perception prevailing with the public. In the past, no one, but no one would look at an AA and say, I can do that,(that was not a photographer, and then even most photographers knew they did not have the talent or expirience) or if we are talking about color, how about Cole Weston? An unsung hero of the color arena or if your predilection is toward more known photographers, how about Elliot Porter?....Not once did I go to a gallery that was showing Porter prints that I heard someone say, I can do that. Or how about a little known photographer John Charles Wood? I once saw a Ciba done by him that was out of this world.

The sad thing was that for all the "content is paramount" that those who practice digital would want us to swallow, those well known photographers did not require a huge print to make their work beautiful. The Wood's print I mention, was only a 5x7...yet it was gorgeous.

This is why I thought of doing only one print per negative, to differentiate myself from digital. Sadly, I am now aware economics do not allow me to do this for all the prints. If I am forced to sell prints from $40 to $70, then I need to sell as many copies of them as I can. It was very dissapointing to see that photographers are only willing to accept change in those areas where it makes it easier for them, not more profitable.

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

roteague — Sun, 27 Jan 2008 11:10:12 GMT

[quote][b]Jorge Gasteazoro (1/27/2008)[/b][hr]Skill in photography has been replaced with skill on a computer program, I don't know how many times I have read "If you think digital is easy then you should try making feathered masks on a multilayer...blah, blah, blah..."[/quote]

Ahhh ... one of those arguments that is so easy to debunk, I'm surprised people still bring it up.

Software continually evolves, with the express goal of making it easier to use. For example, the latest version of Photoshop (CS3) and Lightroom both have a feature called "clarity". This is a new feature to both, however in previous versions you could accomplish the same thing using curves; manipulating curves is one of those techniques that many have found difficult to master. Clarity simplifies this by replacing that manipulation with a slider. And, that is just one example.

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

Jorge Gasteazoro — Sun, 27 Jan 2008 08:59:32 GMT

The problem I see, and I wrote a journal about it (which was taken as being anti digital) is that the essential skills one developed over time to make good photographs are no longer required. Learning to see the light, getting the subject right on the negative or transparency and most importantly utilizing the [b]restraint[/b] to forego taking the photograph or developing the patience to wait until the conditions and the light is right is no longer necessary with digital.

I am sure that many of you have decided not to take a picture simply because the light was not right. Yet, with the advent of digital this is no longer necessary, take the shot, fix it in photoshop. Skill in photography has been replaced with skill on a computer program, I don't know how many times I have read "If you think digital is easy then you should try making feathered masks on a multilayer...blah, blah, blah..."

I mention this for two reasons, the first one and most evident is that this is the reason why film is in danger, people do not have the patience any longer, they want instant gratification. This also applies to photoshop, even if you spend a month fixing pixel by pixel, you see the resulting changes almost immediately. Second, it has come to pass that if you give an infinite number of monkeys and infinte number of typewriters they will eventually write Shakespere's complete works....since film and it's associated costs are no longer an issue, people take an incredible amount of pictures, they are bound to get lucky and get one or two that are nice...so then they say..." I can do that".

Nothing, absolutely nothing compares to a LF transparency, so Rich, next time you hear "I can do that" you should wip out one and ask, "really?!? can you do this?"

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

roteague — Fri, 25 Jan 2008 20:00:19 GMT

[quote][b]naturephoto1 (1/25/2008)[/b]But, I do see those that are more knowledgeable, more interested, and more discerning in terms of the general public, interior designers, interior decorators, collectors, other photographers, and gallery owners that do see and can recognize and appreciate the "vision", the quality and what goes into "fine photographs" as well as the quality of the workmanship.

Rich[/quote]

One of the reasons I'm so bullish on film photography.

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

naturephoto1 — Fri, 25 Jan 2008 17:37:51 GMT

Jorge,

You have no idea how many times at Art shows I have heard some passer by say I can do that. Or honey, you should blow yours up, it will look just like that. A sorry state of affairs from the ignorant masses. But, I do see those that are more knowledgeable, more interested, and more discerning in terms of the general public, interior designers, interior decorators, collectors, other photographers, and gallery owners that do see and can recognize and appreciate the "vision", the quality and what goes into "fine photographs" as well as the quality of the workmanship.

Rich

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

Jorge Gasteazoro — Fri, 25 Jan 2008 11:14:50 GMT

[quote][b]naturephoto1 (1/24/2008)[/b][hr][quote][b]Jorge Gasteazoro (1/23/2008)[/b][hr]I have seen both guides and I found them of little use, or at least they did not have anything that I had not read in books and magazines before.

One thing you might want to is to contact art consultants, specially you Robert, I think you have a good chance on selling a lot fo color work this way.[/quote]

Jorge,

Thanks for the suggestion to Robert. I would think that this would also apply to my work as well. I do have to start contacting galleries as a prime source of sales though, that is for sure.

I personally have resisted a business plan. I am not sure how accurate or how well photographers such as Robert or I could implement such a plan.

Rich[/quote]

I think it would work for you as well Rich. Lets be honest here, I rather sell prints than be shown in MOMA, and most of the prints bought are used for decoration. The idea is to sell to other segment of society than photographers. It seems the only people who buy photography (specially LF) are other photographers...this sucks, sadly it seems that for all the effort that Stieglitz, Adams etc, put into moving photography as art, all of it has been undone by digital and the art stablishment. People see work by Eggleston, Shore, Wall which is lauded by the critics and sells for more than 100K and wonder why is that.

I have been ridiculed for selling on E bay, yet E bay is a great indicator of the market and what sells. Do you want to know what sells the most in B&W? Vintage naked chicks, body builders naked and vintage artist photos. SIlver gelatin prints sell at a rate of 20% and the average price is $25 for the prints and for other cathegories that are not vintage, nudes sell the best at an average price of $35.

From this data, it seems that the best course is marketing to interior decorators at low prices, I think it is sad, but from the data I have gathered and the studies I have done it seems to me that the average joe thinks there is no big deal about photography, that anybody can do it and it is only a matter of pressing the shutter.

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

roteague — Fri, 25 Jan 2008 09:35:17 GMT

I found a link for the audio to the show that inspired me to start this thread. I think it is a good listen; I'll download it once I get home and see what comes.

The audio (MP3) is at: http://www.hawaiipublicradio.org/audio/TBOTA_012008.mp3 in case anyone is interested.

http://www.hawaiipublicradio.org/hpr/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=116&Itemid=118

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

naturephoto1 — Thu, 24 Jan 2008 19:01:39 GMT

[quote][b]Jorge Gasteazoro (1/23/2008)[/b][hr]I have seen both guides and I found them of little use, or at least they did not have anything that I had not read in books and magazines before.

One thing you might want to is to contact art consultants, specially you Robert, I think you have a good chance on selling a lot fo color work this way.[/quote]

Jorge,

Thanks for the suggestion to Robert. I would think that this would also apply to my work as well. I do have to start contacting galleries as a prime source of sales though, that is for sure.

I personally have resisted a business plan. I am not sure how accurate or how well photographers such as Robert or I could implement such a plan.

Rich

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

roteague — Thu, 24 Jan 2008 09:52:21 GMT

Thanks Jorge,

It will probably take me sometime to sit down an write one. This is a subject I have given a lot of thought to ..... Hawaii is a great place to live, but the market for my type of work is limited.

I was just looking to get a bit of discussion going, and to see what others are doing. Rich (naturephoto1) has done art shows and such for quite a few years, so I'm interested in his take on this as well.

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

Jorge Gasteazoro — Wed, 23 Jan 2008 18:42:31 GMT

I have seen both guides and I found them of little use, or at least they did not have anything that I had not read in books and magazines before.

One thing you might want to is to contact art consultants, specially you Robert, I think you have a good chance on selling a lot fo color work this way.

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

roteague — Wed, 23 Jan 2008 11:21:09 GMT

I would think that the issue of personality would come into play when it comes to developing a marketing plan. Some people are much more comfortable writing things down than others. Although, when I read the literature of people like Zig Ziglar and Jack Canfield they consider writing down goals to be of vital importance. At what is a marketing plan really, but a goal.

Doing a quick Google search, I've come up with a couple of interesting articles:

http://www.danheller.com/biz-marketing.html
http://www.marketing-for-photographers-and-photography.com/

I'll have to think of this a bit further.

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

Jorge Gasteazoro — Wed, 23 Jan 2008 08:49:55 GMT

I thought of doing one, but then it seemed it would be a waste of time for me. With commercial photography it is easy to identify your target audience, with decorative art it is not so easy. Unfortunately it seems the old way of contacting galleries and trying to get representation is the only way.. :(

RE: Marketing Plans for Photographers

Eirik Berger — Wed, 23 Jan 2008 04:29:19 GMT

Yes and no.

My (professional) photography is divided in two areas, the commercial part and the more personal art photography (print sales).

For my commercial activity I made a business plan when I started. I got good help from a business consultant that didn´t now anything about photography, but he sure knew how to run a business in general. But I must admit as the years passed the plan is in the bottom of the big pile of paper on my desk. I don´t use it actively anymore, and then of course it is no longer a businnes plan but a piece of paper.

For my personal "art" photography I don´t have any plan at all. I just make the best prints I can and sell them via local galleries and my website. I don´t sell a lot and that is most likely due to poor marketing. I am fairly new to this so this is still a work in progress. So, of course now is the time that I really should have a market plan. :)

Marketing Plans for Photographers

roteague — Tue, 22 Jan 2008 14:32:11 GMT

Should a photographer have a marketing plan?

I was listening to a local radio show on Sunday night, called "The Business of the Arts", where they discuss various business subjects for artists. This Sunday, they discussed marketing plans for photographers. The question came up about having written marketing plans. I know that I don't, although I do have an idea of what my target audience is.

So, do you have a written marketing plan, and have you found doing so to be a valuable asset to your business?